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That’s the neat part: We’re all browsing the same content.
People who call this whole thing complicated are just, I dunno, incapable of understanding the concept of logging in? It doesn’t matter what door you go in, it’s all (mostly) the same room.
It’s actually a copy of the original room, and there are invisible goblins synchronising all objects in the rooms so that it looks like the same room. They are also moving mannequins so that they match the movements of all the people in the other rooms.
To us it looks and feels like the same room with the same objecs and same people, so it doesn’t really matter.
But sometimes an admin might order that the goblins must not sync one specific room anymore. Then you start to notice differences depending on which door (=room) you actually use.
I’m not trying to make it sound bad. Else I’d have used something like “maliciously” or whatever. I’m just trying say that sometimes you might actually see differences (e.g. beehaw.org communities on lemmy.world after defederation), and this is only possible because there are multiple rooms and not just one (with this analogy).
I wouldnt say incapable. Before I joined I was unsure about this whole federation thing as well. I was worried that I have to sign up to multiple instances (and this is actually not untrue, because of defederation) but I worried too much. It’s a lot easier than I imagined
Yeah, before I got into this Fediverse thingy, I too thought that I would have to create bazillions of accounts across different servers and that this is a terrible “business model.” Look where I am now, with a matrix account, lemmy account, and a mastodon account and all the Fedi-thingies. We need to somehow let people understand how the Fediverse works better.
There’s a difference between “incapable of understanding” and “doesn’t have enough background information to understand.” Are there people who can’t understand certain tech concepts? Absolutely. But there are a lot more people who just miss the first rung on the ladder, and can’t make it to the top. They can understand when they get the explanation from the ground up, but until then, they’re stuck.
I see it happen a lot when tech people try to explain something that is brand new to the listener, because when you are already able to understand something at a high level, you forget to mention the first several rungs. It’s usually a great explanation, it’s just not an explanation the person on the ground can use.
…also, I don’t think it’s failure to understand login when every instance asks for a separate login if you don’t navigate there through your own instance. It’s a misunderstanding that results from experiencing the fediverse without understanding how it works, not a failure to grasp an abstract concept.
Just so that nobody gets confused, it gets constantly synced, not just at the end of the day. That’s just an unfortunate use of a common saying in this case. :)
Lol! Also worthing noting that federation is not yet working perfectly, and there are legitimate reasons why your choice of instance matters a great deal.
Many instances are not yet properly configured and there is a real barrier to joining and participating in communities on other servers. This is a good thing, because it means that Lemmy can get even better in the future.
Kbin includes some mastodon/twitter-like functionality. It also makes public what you vote for and the interface is subjectively nicer. It also have PWA support for the main websites.
However, it doesn’t have app support right now. There’s significantly more development on that front with Lemmy.
While I am posting from a lemmy account (because I didn’t know about kbin when I made it) if I was to host one of the two it would be kbin.
The reason is that lemmy has some hardcoded moderation things inside it that I disapprove of.
I believe I should be able to say anything I want without fear of being censored on my own self hosted instance and this comes from a leftist, I don’t want to use bad words to insult people, but if I want to use them in a different context I want to be able to.
If I see an argument between a bigot and a fellow lgbtq and the bigot calls my comrade with a slur I want to be able to describe the situation using the exact words used.
I think maybe it’s a cultural difference thing, where I live using slurs in a context where we describe a situation rather than for insulting someone it’s not seen as a bad thing. We don’t give those words so much power and importance to the point that even just saying the words makes people gasp.
I believe that censoring some words by default without even considering the context they are being used in doesn’t help, I believe it just gives the words more power while we should aim to take power away from them.
The “slur filter” was causing so much arguing that the devs stopped hard coding it. Now the whoever is running the instance can choose any or no filter.
To me, Kbin isn’t really ready to be used by the average person. I get a lot of error messages and many communities are missing, no matter which Kbin instance I choose. I’ll move to Kbin when it’s a little more fleshed out. For now, I’ll stick to Lemmy.
Is kbin not just another Lemmy instance? I keep seeing people mention it alongside Lemmy like it’s something different, but it doesn’t seem to be when I look.
The content is the same, as it federates with lemmy, but the server and the code that runs kbin is completely different, it’s written in php while lemmy is written in rust. Kbin also has support for microblogs (like mastodon) so it’s not lemmy at all really, but it can talk with it :)
I’ll stick with kbin, but we’re all friends here. 👍
That’s the neat part: We’re all browsing the same content.
People who call this whole thing complicated are just, I dunno, incapable of understanding the concept of logging in? It doesn’t matter what door you go in, it’s all (mostly) the same room.
It’s actually a copy of the original room, and there are invisible goblins synchronising all objects in the rooms so that it looks like the same room. They are also moving mannequins so that they match the movements of all the people in the other rooms.
To us it looks and feels like the same room with the same objecs and same people, so it doesn’t really matter.
But sometimes an admin might order that the goblins must not sync one specific room anymore. Then you start to notice differences depending on which door (=room) you actually use.
Maliciously order an goblin?
They’re talking about defederating and trying to make it sound bad.
I’m not trying to make it sound bad. Else I’d have used something like “maliciously” or whatever. I’m just trying say that sometimes you might actually see differences (e.g. beehaw.org communities on lemmy.world after defederation), and this is only possible because there are multiple rooms and not just one (with this analogy).
It is bad if we care about adoption right now
I wouldnt say incapable. Before I joined I was unsure about this whole federation thing as well. I was worried that I have to sign up to multiple instances (and this is actually not untrue, because of defederation) but I worried too much. It’s a lot easier than I imagined
Yeah, before I got into this Fediverse thingy, I too thought that I would have to create bazillions of accounts across different servers and that this is a terrible “business model.” Look where I am now, with a matrix account, lemmy account, and a mastodon account and all the Fedi-thingies. We need to somehow let people understand how the Fediverse works better.
There’s a difference between “incapable of understanding” and “doesn’t have enough background information to understand.” Are there people who can’t understand certain tech concepts? Absolutely. But there are a lot more people who just miss the first rung on the ladder, and can’t make it to the top. They can understand when they get the explanation from the ground up, but until then, they’re stuck.
I see it happen a lot when tech people try to explain something that is brand new to the listener, because when you are already able to understand something at a high level, you forget to mention the first several rungs. It’s usually a great explanation, it’s just not an explanation the person on the ground can use.
…also, I don’t think it’s failure to understand login when every instance asks for a separate login if you don’t navigate there through your own instance. It’s a misunderstanding that results from experiencing the fediverse without understanding how it works, not a failure to grasp an abstract concept.
A week ago, I would have said that’s it’s complicated, but I just login into lemmy.world and I can browse minutes of content!!!
We still need the crowd
yes, I tried bringing some but all I got is a big fat NO sooo we still need to wait
Who? What was their reason?
Reddit, no reason provided
they federate nicely at the end of the day, and that’s what matters
Just so that nobody gets confused, it gets constantly synced, not just at the end of the day. That’s just an unfortunate use of a common saying in this case. :)
Lol! Also worthing noting that federation is not yet working perfectly, and there are legitimate reasons why your choice of instance matters a great deal.
Many instances are not yet properly configured and there is a real barrier to joining and participating in communities on other servers. This is a good thing, because it means that Lemmy can get even better in the future.
why kbin over lemmy? havent tested it out much.
Kbin includes some mastodon/twitter-like functionality. It also makes public what you vote for and the interface is subjectively nicer. It also have PWA support for the main websites.
However, it doesn’t have app support right now. There’s significantly more development on that front with Lemmy.
While I am posting from a lemmy account (because I didn’t know about kbin when I made it) if I was to host one of the two it would be kbin. The reason is that lemmy has some hardcoded moderation things inside it that I disapprove of. I believe I should be able to say anything I want without fear of being censored on my own self hosted instance and this comes from a leftist, I don’t want to use bad words to insult people, but if I want to use them in a different context I want to be able to. If I see an argument between a bigot and a fellow lgbtq and the bigot calls my comrade with a slur I want to be able to describe the situation using the exact words used. I think maybe it’s a cultural difference thing, where I live using slurs in a context where we describe a situation rather than for insulting someone it’s not seen as a bad thing. We don’t give those words so much power and importance to the point that even just saying the words makes people gasp. I believe that censoring some words by default without even considering the context they are being used in doesn’t help, I believe it just gives the words more power while we should aim to take power away from them.
Also kbin has a much prettier UI in my opinion.
The “slur filter” was causing so much arguing that the devs stopped hard coding it. Now the whoever is running the instance can choose any or no filter.
Ah that’s good.
slur_filter_regexdoesn’t seem to have a value by default, so I don’t understand your point.I might be misinformed then, I’ll have look better into it.
My understanding is the differences are superficial, since they’re both interfaces to activity pub.
For me personally, it’s the cleaner (stock) UI
Found it first.
To me, Kbin isn’t really ready to be used by the average person. I get a lot of error messages and many communities are missing, no matter which Kbin instance I choose. I’ll move to Kbin when it’s a little more fleshed out. For now, I’ll stick to Lemmy.
I haven’t had any issues.
Kbin is great too! Definitely has its upsides.
Is kbin not just another Lemmy instance? I keep seeing people mention it alongside Lemmy like it’s something different, but it doesn’t seem to be when I look.
The content is the same, as it federates with lemmy, but the server and the code that runs kbin is completely different, it’s written in php while lemmy is written in rust. Kbin also has support for microblogs (like mastodon) so it’s not lemmy at all really, but it can talk with it :)