Yes, more Chinese infrastructure, that phones home and can be turned off remotely, with a switch, is definitely what the West need.
and thats any worse than US tech because?
Oh no, I mentioned China, so .ml weirdoes come knocking
Who said it was worse? Why did you imply that?
Why just a tariff? Just ban all Tesla vehicle imports and all sales of new Tesla vehicles. For owners of existing vehicles they should be offered a generous buyback and equally generous loan terms for a new or used car. That would encourage most Tesla owners to trade-in their vehicles.
Or just fix public transit for fucks sake. Evs are a distraction from the problemm
101% this. Driving my mates and I yesterday on a completely packed 4 lane highway. 90% of cars were a single driver, no pasangers.
Even if we exclude tradie vans and utes who ill assume are at least transporting tools and gear, if every one of those vehicles carried 1 other person or chose to bike instead ( Christchurch, New Zealeand, we have good biking infrastructure also a bike path that follows the length of the highway) or even take the bus (public transport is pretty good) we would see an instant 50% reduction in traffic over night.
Did traffic get worse in nz in the past few years? When i was there there was absolutely no traffic but to be fair i mainly went to the rural parts so maybe i just missed it. Even so the larger cities could be connected by public transit, especially when theres a 10 hour drive from one city to another one, a train there would be much more comfortable. Its basically a straight line as well so the train could go pretty fast withoutnany big sacrifices. Idk tho i only spent 3 weeks there, not an expert by any means.
The benefit of a tarrif on Tesla vs opening the market to China is that we can easily undo it if there is a US coup, Trump gets medicated, gets burned, whatever. There’s still the potential that this is a temporary situation, not the new reality. If we open up to a third party, we can’t put the genie back in the bottle.
I was thinking the same thing. I always thought one of the main reasons for the 100% tariffs was to be in line with what the US wanted. But with things being the way they are, I think we should open the door for Chinese EVs. If it benefits Canada, we should do it. I’m not well versed on the Chinese EVs, but from some of the documentaries I’ve seen, the quality is comparable to the US models, if not better, due to the features that they pack into their base models. I know that there are concerns about eavesdropping and data collection, but isn’t that a risk with the US too? And especially the way the US is now, I’d trust them even less. Because it goes beyond the data collection, it goes to their intention of annexation.
I’d rather we open the door to Chinese EVs, or any other competitors, just so our trade is more diversified. (I’m not familiar with the infrastructure investments that would be required for Chinese EVs, or policy adjustments, I just think it’s something that should be seriously explored and implemented, just so we’re not so dependent on the US alone).
Why not do both? I like public transit idea but does not work for smaller/rural communities
Someone’s doing the happy hunny dance…
That feels like “robbing Peter to pay Paul”. We don’t want to be dependent on either nationalist autocracy.
Mercedes make pretty good EVs but dunno if they’re in Canada. They’re definitely cheaper in Europe though.
I dont think there is a single privacy friendly EV on the market.
If a Canadian company could build and export an EV that wasn’t loaded with invasive sensors and where the data recording and uploading was opt-in (or non existent), loads of US Americans and Europeans would import them from Canada.
I’m pretty sure the VW E-Up is (can be made) privacy friendly (the datamodule that sends the data to VW and into your account can be replaced with an OVMS datamodule)
I think you can expand that to all cars, not just EVs.
Hopefully ICE bans will expand in the near future
I hope aptera will save us.
I think we should build them ourselves.
Canada has the same incentive to not open the door to Chinese EVs that the US does.
Why would they shoot themselves in the face just to splash some blood on someone else?
Canada doesn’t have the incentives that the Americans have at all. Correct me if I’m wrong. America’s incentive is to protect its own EV industry, Canada doesn’t have an EV industry of its own.
You’re wrong. Just the nature of of the auto industry makes it a little confusing since the entirety of a car isn’t manufactured in one country. But there are a lot of components for EVs manufactured in Canada. There’s especially a focus on manufacturing batteries for EVs which is the single most important component in an EV. And more plants for battery manufacturing are under construction.
What is the reason btw? Genuinely asking because I dunno
It isn’t that an inexpensive electric vehicle from China is bad, in fact that’s great.
The issue is that the cars are subsidized at such a rate that it goes beyond domestic incentive and into “we’ll just make sure no matter what we can sell for less than the competition” in an effort to drive any competition out of business.
It’s an anticompetitive practice that has significant impacts if allowed unchecked.
This is not meant as a value statement about the west, USA or Canada … as in I’m not saying “China bad when they do it, west good when they do it” because it’s bad when it’s done by whoever does it.
Effectively it’s a lever to weaponize fair trade and that’s antithetical to the idea of fair trade, at least insomuch as the international community tends to agree.
A worthwhile note is also that pretty much all US car manufacturers have dragged their feet doing EVs, excluding Tesla. So naturally US car manufacturers are struggling a lot with the massive costs related to adopting EVs now, and struggle competing with a country that spent this money getting established a good while ago.
The subsidies are still a problem, but the 100% tax is in my view a massive handout to domestic manufacturers that never bothered to try until they were behind. That 100% price increase in Chinese will probably mean high margins on EVs for yet some years before cheap alternatives come along.
It’s a fuck you to European partners also.
Fucking someone over isn’t worth fucking everyone over.
Why does that matter to Canada? They don’t make their own EVs. They have no domestic manufacturers to protect against dumping. Might as well just get as many cheap vehicles as you can, while you can.
Yes but Canada has no EV industry… so, even if it’s just temporarily to provide Canadians with an option while telling American companies to suck it… what’s the problem?
Are we really going to say we don’t to business with China because of anti-competitive practices when we have been doing business with American doing WAY worse all along?
It’s not just US companies harmed.
One also would think more long term and hope for better relations with Canada and USA having more cooperative relations especially as it pertains to an auto market.
Regardless harming your European allies to spite the US isn’t ideal either.
It’s not just US companies harmed.
Who else is harmed in this case?
One also would think more long term and hope for better relations with Canada and USA having more cooperative relations especially as it pertains to an auto market.
Why? this is exactly what we had and Trump destroyed… why would be trust them again? ever?.. even if we go back to a trade agreement, there should be hard guarantees in place to be able to trust the USA again in pretty much anything
Regardless harming your European allies to spite the US isn’t ideal either.
Why would that be the case at all? I am all for opening the Canadian market to European auto makers (very few make it here)… Most people who can afford it never buy American cars anyway as they are fairly low in everything when compared to Asian or European brands.
Why would reducing tariffs on Chinese EVs harm European allies when we already barely allow them into the Canadian market?
Get them to help build factories in Canada
I have a better alternative: invest in viable alternatives to driving! expand protected bike lanes, build the damn high speed rail, more trains, trams and bus lines. One more asphalt lane for cars wont solve traffic problems :)
Our newly-elected Premier has unfortunately doubled down on giving cars priority with the mandated removal of bike lanes and building new highways (413), even though their own data says that Toronto with be just as congested a few years after building them.
Oh I forgot to mention the tunnel under the 401, which is a massive boondoggle waiting to happen
Along with more work from home jobs?
Just make it so that commutes count as clocked-in time, and let the market sort it out.
Walkable cities. Biking infrastructure. Reliable public transit.
Regularless of of what’d going on in the world right now, these would make our cities far better.
Love this idea; however, bringing Chinese cars is like applying pressure to the wound… fixing public transportation is the long term healing process.
1 - They are not mutually exclusive, bring the Chinese cars now while starting on the long term public transportation projects
2 - The Federal gov can act on the Chinese cars now… public transportation is 100% Provincial purview so an entirely different team needs to address this other priority
As someone who loves driving cars, I’m completely on board with this. Driving should be optional, and I’d love to leave the car home when I go out partying, or don’t want to worry about leaving my nice ride somewhere sketchy overnight.
That would work for much of the population that lives within 100 miles of the US border, but there is a lot of rural and green space in Canada, and bikes aren’t great in Canadian winters. Canada needs good car options too.
As of the 2021 census, nearly 6 million people (16% of the total Canadian population) lived in rural areas of Canada.
84% of Canadians live in cities, and that’s where good urban infrastructure is the most needed.
Making car-centric infrastructure mostly electric will help a bit, but not a whole lot.And spending that money to get us cheaper transit in the long term will probably also free up more resources to help the remaining 16%.
Oh, I agree that mass transit wouldn’t really work in areas that aren’t as dense, but we should definitely have those where possible. I didn’t mean to say we don’t need good car options, but we should also have more options besides just cars
Now regarding bikes and winter, I’d say that’s more of an infrastructure problem. Finland also has terrible winter, yet they can bike as usual. You should watch this video if you are interested in this theme: “Why Canadians Can’t Bike in the Winter (but Finnish people can)”
I understand that infrastructure is more important to be able to cycle in the winter, even eclipsing temperature in very cold areas. I live in an area where there is no bicycle infrastructure, I’m actually 100x safer riding my motorcycle well below freezing on the road, than riding my bicycle on a beautiful fall day. And I do, I have gear for it .There are cities though, where temperatures don’t regularly get super cold and people don’t actually have the clothing and gear to cycle in the winter. I would guess in those areas, temperature is more of a factor. In areas where winters are consistently very cold, people already have what they need and are able to cycle if the infrastructure is there.
In cities at least, bikes are just as good as cars in winter. Your city just needs to put as much effort in to building and clearing bike lanes as it does car lanes. Places that give a shit actually plow and salt their bike paths and bike lanes.
In cities at least, bikes are just as good as cars in winte
Your bike has a heater built-in and a way to block out the cold wind and/or rain?
That’s usually what people mean when they mention vehicles in the winter, not just the road being cleared
That’s just a matter of having the proper clothing.
Having ridden bikes in snow (and would be willing to again): yeah, no, they’re a very different experience and to pretend otherwise is to engage in a shocking level of willful ignorance
This is the way
Bang on!
Tesla stands no chance to compete with Chinese vehicles. It’s wild how high quality and cheap these Chinese cars are.
I wouldn’t really call the high quality tbh. At least better than Tesla.
Supposedly, the quality is amazing. Here in the Netherlands, a car called Zeekr is making the rounds. They’re supposed to be terrific cars. And that’s a brand I had never heard of until a few weeks ago
Why can’t you guys make your own? Its not hard. Musk figured it out.
No he didn’t. They were already making them when he got there.
OK, but the design is very simple. Even Musk could figure it out alone. LiFEPO4 18650 packs have been plentiful before Tesla. All they did was add a bus that melts at excess temps
musk didn’t build anything.
I mean, we literally can and have (as a concept car). Should I link my recent post here about it?
Yes
