As the car industry’s largest hybrid pusher, Toyota says it is better positioned to just buy credits to close the EPA gap rather than “waste” money on BEVs, its CEO said.
It’s where “green” hydrogen comes from — which everyone keeps promoting as the future. People claim “oh we can just split water using electricity from solar wind and nuclear”. Not considering that it takes a lot of energy to do that. Energy that you’d get better bang for your buck by putting into batteries.
Oh. Well that’s a silly distinction of them to make. Hydrogen is abundant and refining processes are constantly getting cleaner, especially these days, no worries.
And can be used for hydrogen fuel cells regardless.
What is your specific stance?
As I’ve stated, I don’t really care about hydrogen fuel cells, but you keep repeating vague information as if this is a standard debate that everybody has defined and understands what you’re talking about.
What is your point here?
Do you just not understand that hydrogen is abundant, or do you not understand that it can be extracted from multiple sources for hydrogen fuel cells?
I’m leaning toward the latter because of how confused you sound about multiple sources of hydrogen fuel.
Hydrogen derived from natural gas can not be used in fuel cells. Only hydrolysis hydrogen is viable.
It is one of ‘many’ reasons why hydrogen fuel will never be a thing.
Along with Hydrogen seeping through everything
Along with Hydrogen embrittlement
The energy efficiency loss to convert Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Hydrogen -> Mechanical or Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Hydrogen -> Electrical -> Mechanical
Will never be cost effective compared to Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Electrical(batt) -> Mechanical
Hydrogen has been known to man for a 1000 years, and yet
Gobal International WARS have been fought in the past century along with massive geopolitical maneuvering and trillions upon trillions of $$$ spent on the energy sector.
Do you really thing we’d be spending the $$$ we do for deep sea drilling if hydrogen was even close to being a viable resource?
No new technology has been developed that makes hydrogen useful. No. Fuel Cells are not it.
There just isn’t enough energy gained by connecting Hydrogen -> Oxygen no matter what process you come up with.
Unless we find a way to fuse hydrogen together, hydrogen is a dead end and always has been.
Is that where you think hydrogen comes from?
It’s literally the most abundant element in the universe, present in many forms in, at this point, practically infinite amounts.
Most of it is harvested from natural gas these days.
It’s where “green” hydrogen comes from — which everyone keeps promoting as the future. People claim “oh we can just split water using electricity from solar wind and nuclear”. Not considering that it takes a lot of energy to do that. Energy that you’d get better bang for your buck by putting into batteries.
Oh. Well that’s a silly distinction of them to make. Hydrogen is abundant and refining processes are constantly getting cleaner, especially these days, no worries.
[citation needed]
I am shocked at how few people know how abundant hydrogen is.
Here, this article explains how hydrogen makes up 75% of the universe we understand:
https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/energy-explained/what-is-hydrogen#:~:text=Hydrogen is a clean alternative,and%2C of course%2C humans.
Removed by mod
Are you asking a question?
Because the hydrogen I’m mentioning is accessible to be put into fuel cells.
While hydrogen is common, free H2 molecules are not
Correct. That is where fuel processing comes into play.
For all fuels, let’s say gasoline for example, you can’t just grab a bowl of oil from a crude oil well and dump it into your fuel tank.
The fuel needs to be carefully refined and processed.
Same with hydrogen, same with biofuels, that’s how refined fuels work.
You can’t use natural gas hydrogen for a fuel cell.
They can’t remove enough sulphur from it, and even a trace amount will destroy the fuel cell.
Here’s several methods companies can produce viable hydrogen from natural gas:
https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-productioen-natural-gas-reforming
As well as a few other materials:
https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-fuel-basics
Nope those all contain trace hydrogen sulfide.
And can be used for hydrogen fuel cells regardless.
What is your specific stance?
As I’ve stated, I don’t really care about hydrogen fuel cells, but you keep repeating vague information as if this is a standard debate that everybody has defined and understands what you’re talking about.
What is your point here?
Do you just not understand that hydrogen is abundant, or do you not understand that it can be extracted from multiple sources for hydrogen fuel cells?
I’m leaning toward the latter because of how confused you sound about multiple sources of hydrogen fuel.
My point is simple.
Hydrogen derived from natural gas can not be used in fuel cells. Only hydrolysis hydrogen is viable.
It is one of ‘many’ reasons why hydrogen fuel will never be a thing.
Along with Hydrogen seeping through everything
Along with Hydrogen embrittlement
The energy efficiency loss to convert Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Hydrogen -> Mechanical or Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Hydrogen -> Electrical -> Mechanical
Will never be cost effective compared to Solar/Wind/Nuc -> Electrical(batt) -> Mechanical
Hydrogen has been known to man for a 1000 years, and yet
Gobal International WARS have been fought in the past century along with massive geopolitical maneuvering and trillions upon trillions of $$$ spent on the energy sector.
Do you really thing we’d be spending the $$$ we do for deep sea drilling if hydrogen was even close to being a viable resource?
No new technology has been developed that makes hydrogen useful. No. Fuel Cells are not it.
There just isn’t enough energy gained by connecting Hydrogen -> Oxygen no matter what process you come up with.
Unless we find a way to fuse hydrogen together, hydrogen is a dead end and always has been.
SMR, a process by which hydrogen is derived from natural gas, accounts for 95 percent of today’s refined hydrogen that can be used in fuel cells.
https://time.com/6098910/blue-hydrogen-emissions/
NGR partial oxidation -
https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-production-natural-gas-reforming
There are new hydrogen processing tech being worked on right now.
There are other ways of processing hydrogen.
Do you mean green hydrogen?
Because you keep saying “Hydrogen derived from natural gas can not be used in fuel cells” but must of hydrogen today is refined from natural gas.
I’m not big on hydrogen fuel cells, but your claim strays pretty far from the mark.